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Amateur Manx 40M preparation

This is a discussion on Amateur Manx 40M preparation within the Vintage Motorcycle Racing forums, part of the Caferacer.net Forums category; Original engine did some parade laps in -95. Not the faintest what oil was used then. "Spare" engine will hopefully commence run in period next ...

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Thread: Amateur Manx 40M preparation

  1. #11
    Senior Member Mike 40M's Avatar
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    Original engine did some parade laps in -95. Not the faintest what oil was used then. "Spare" engine will hopefully commence run in period next month. Old engine looks good on the outside and moves freely. Only rust on bike worth mentioning is front springs and interior of clutch.Some nuts has got a brown patina. Surprisingly good bolts and nuts for a bike which has spent most of its life in a metric country. Most previous owners must have used proper tools.
    Spent the afternoon replacing worn parts in front legs. Tomorrow time for finishing front fork.
    Thinking of replacing handlebars and levers with modern parts. Original has obviously had some ground contact. Makes it impossible to fix barends yo them.
    Seems I soon have enough original parts to build another bike.

  2. #12
    Senior Member jalsteve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike 40M View Post
    Original engine did some parade laps in -95. Not the faintest what oil was used then. "Spare" engine will hopefully commence run in period next month. Old engine looks good on the outside and moves freely. Only rust on bike worth mentioning is front springs and interior of clutch.Some nuts has got a brown patina. Surprisingly good bolts and nuts for a bike which has spent most of its life in a metric country. Most previous owners must have used proper tools.
    Spent the afternoon replacing worn parts in front legs. Tomorrow time for finishing front fork.
    Thinking of replacing handlebars and levers with modern parts. Original has obviously had some ground contact. Makes it impossible to fix barends yo them.
    Seems I soon have enough original parts to build another bike.

    Personally I would do exactly that, build a full replica and restore the original to original.

    Milling the gearbox is a 20 min job.

    Just make sure the oil is fully drained from the old engine or flush it with diesel.

    Oil for the new engine, I use Miller CFS 10/60 full ester and it is superb. I use this in all plain shell bearing dry and wet clutch engines.
    Lite the blue touch paper and stand well back!

  3. #13
    Senior Member Mike 40M's Avatar
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    Triple crown in place. New small issue. How much oil in fork. Talked with a Norton dommie friend from the good old days without speed limits. He had heard from a racer that a Coca-Cola bottle is right. Can anybody confirm that 192 cc is right amount?

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  5. #14
    Senior Member jalsteve's Avatar
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    Fork oil 20 grade. If the damper rods and damper bodies are worn you might end up using 30 grade.

    Oil quantity - extend the fork fully then compress without the spring - measure the movement (x) now add 2". Fill the fork till you have an air gap of x+2 make sure the damper tubes are filled but moving the sliders up and down a few times. Don't leave less than 2" Boils law and all that.

    Don't use dominator quantity as you don't have an internal spring taking up volume.

    So you won't put enough in.

  6. #15
    Senior Member jalsteve's Avatar
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    That's me, on a 86 bore forks filled as above and going underneath an ex works Ducati. He had his knee down, hanging off the saddle all very stylish! Me just sitting quiet and letting the bike do it's job. Hated those leathers though they would balloon up - sort of odd looking. Still it looks like he's been blown off by a fat fucker riding a tractor. Managed to wear a nice little flat on the gear change too.
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    Last edited by jalsteve; 03-29-2017 at 03:13 PM.

  7. #16
    Senior Member Mike 40M's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalsteve View Post
    Fork oil 20 grade. If the damper rods and damper bodies are worn you might end up using 30 grade.

    Oil quantity - extend the fork fully then compress without the spring - measure the movement (x) now add 2". Fill the fork till you have an air gap of x+2 make sure the damper tubes are filled but moving the sliders up and down a few times. Don't leave less than 2" Boils law and all that.

    Don't use dominator quantity as you don't have an internal spring taking up volume.

    So you won't put enough in.
    Just checking if I got it right,.
    Using one of those modern tools for setting fork oil level.
    Movement =6". Add 2" equals 8".
    With fork fully compressed.
    Oil level 8 inches below top of stanchion.

    Found not enough 20 oil at home, have to get more.
    Last edited by Mike 40M; 03-30-2017 at 02:32 AM.

  8. #17
    Senior Member jalsteve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike 40M View Post
    Just checking if I got it right,.
    Using one of those modern tools for setting fork oil level.
    Movement =6". Add 2" equals 8".
    With fork fully compressed.
    Oil level 8 inches below top of stanchion.
    With the forks fully extended.

    Are your forks manx length Roadholder? Or road? Manx stanchions are shorter.

    Manx are 20.375"
    Short Roadholder are 21.843"
    Last edited by jalsteve; 03-30-2017 at 03:01 AM.
    Lite the blue touch paper and stand well back!

  9. #18
    Senior Member Mike 40M's Avatar
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    It's normal Manx forks. Just checked level. 6.5" compressed. Seems that coke bottle idea from a famous Manx racer was a bit on the low side.
    While waiting for more oil, I will do a bit of milling of the TTI-box. Alternative would be to make new engine plates with gearbox higher.

  10. #19
    Senior Member jalsteve's Avatar
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    Or just put 200-210mls in of 20grade and not lighter.

    Manx forks (late) are really quite simple but work really well, compression is controlled by the holes drilled around the bottom of the stanchion, rebound by the damper tube. IF compression is too soft you can weld up (or braze) up the holes and re drill smaller. I also find than the original Norton multi rate springs are too soft, even when new in the 60's, and the forks need a little more preload especially as we are all a little bigger, leathers weigh more, heavy boots and space helmet. So don't be surprised if they bottom out, just buy new springs, Molnars are good and maintain original ride height. I have tried adding packing on old springs and it doesn't work, ride height goes up and the spring is still soft.
    Lite the blue touch paper and stand well back!

  11. #20
    Senior Member jalsteve's Avatar
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    How is the gearbox fatter, I assumed it was wider across the mounts?

    Sometime I have to let the engine plates a little forward of the gearbox to allow the gearbox to pivot on the lower bolt and use all of the adjustment slot. Photo would be good?
    Lite the blue touch paper and stand well back!

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