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Discussion Starter #1
johnnyB's post:

Zack... in all seriousness... I do plan on getting one if at all possible.... I was just whining to the ole lady that Aaron and Zack and just everybody has got one and I should have one too.

My big issue is I've got no time to spend dicking around with one. I need one that's close to right, dependable and as low maintaince as a GP two stroke can be. I don't mind giving up a few hp to ride something I don't have to screw with. Learning curve will be such that it will be a couple of years before I should be needing any more juice.

Gotta be a post 93 or whatever the big change date was...95?
JohnnyB

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johnnyB - yes, 95s are significantly better than 94s. i'm pretty sure that's the year they went to a newer/better frame, cassette transmission, 5-spoke OEM wheels and maybe some other stuff. i would even shoot for a 96 or 97, because they're really not that much more. 98s went to a different kind of carb, little more complicated. bodywork interchanges between almost all post-95 bikes i think. i'll sell you mine for $250,000 'cause i like you. all you have to do is sell that 50 of yours. just kidding...i'd let it go for $210,000.

Z
 

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I'll give you 195,000 and not a penny more.

I keep getting this nagging feeling to sell the RC and get a nice RS. If I lived an hour from a track I'd do it. But I need my fix once a week and Loudon is too far.

Can 96 or 97's be found for about 3,000? I'd like something as close to stock as possible.

JohnnyB
 

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absolutely, my bike is a 96 and it's worth maybe $2,000. you could definitely find a nice, competitive 125 for 3,000 or less maybe. there's some stuff you'll want along with it, like extra wheels, jets, and various spares. most of them that are for sale come with a bunch of spares though. the wheels are the big thing, unless you don't want to ride in the rain, then you could get away with one set. how are you about riding in the rain?

Z
 

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I don't have a problem riding a 23hp four stroke vintage bike in the rain... I probably go 85%..depends on what the guy in front of me is doing. I kind of like the rain cause a lot of people go really slow and it's easy for me to look fast.

Not so sure how I would feel about a 40hp two stroke. Although I assume the grip is good with wets. I probably wouldn't let a set of spare rain wheels make or break a deal for me...certainly not the first year.

My deal is I want to be able to dump in the premix and ride. I don't mind doing the top end once a year..hell I do that on my four strokes. But I want to be able to jet in the ball park...don't care if I give up a few hp on a hot day. I don't mind changing a jet to race but I don't want to spend my day doing jetting runs.

I'd be very happy running 1:27 or 1:28 after some practice. Maybe 1:25 or something by the end of the year.

Heck...if I can get one for $2500 I'll put it on the credit card this spring. Gonna need a bigger trailer.
JohnnyB
 

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JohnnyB,

If at all possible try to pick up a 125. It is by far the most awesome fun racer I ever swung a leg over. Acceleration and Braking is really cool. The weird thing about them is trying to get them rolling at the start. You have to kind of sort of wind them up and slip the clutch to get them going. Once you get going I felt like I was driving a big rig with an 18 speed transmission. The power band is so unlike the 4 strokes we ride. Shift-shift-shift.

Talent reigns with Z(whole different set of rules at that level) so it would be fun to watch you and Aaron dice it up.



Champ
 

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quote:
slip the clutch to get them going. Once you get going I felt like I was driving a big rig with an 18 speed transmission. The power band is so unlike the 4 strokes we ride. Shift-shift-shift.
Keep the rpms between 9500 and 11500... that's where the fun is.
6 gears, no waiting!
 

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Discussion Starter #8
quote:

Keep the rpms between 9500 and 11500... that's where the fun is.
6 gears, no waiting!
i would have said 10,000 and 12,500. but that's nitpicking a bit. i actually thought my dad's 125 had more power than mine until he told me to rev it higher. i was shifting at like 11, and if you go to 12,5 it makes a big difference. the powerband is so abrubt it's hard to tell the difference sometimes.

johnnyB - you've got a handle on lean angle, you could definitely do a 1.25, no problem. once you wrap your mind around the peaky motor, powerful brakes and the silly G-forces in turn 6, you'll be a man on the move.
 

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Zack,
You know, you're about the first person to mention the only part of Loudon that I have a hard time "wraping my mind around". It's the G-forces in six... It's not the line that I find hard, or the lean angle, or traction worries...to be honest it's simply I find the G-forces very distracting in that turn. I let my head drop and kind of end up looking at the rumble strip instead of where I'm going.

I spend a lot of time on modern sport bikes so hopefully experience with big brakes will translate to something on the track, not sure If I'll be carrying the rear wheel for a while :)....strange though... I can do that on the street...different I guess when you are doing it on purpose rather than as a by product of hard braking for a reason.

Anyway... how is engine reliability shifting at 12.5 K? What's the redline on these bikes? I've noticed when you carry the rear coming into the 3 that the back end will come around a bit. Is that you? The bike? or the track?

Maybe Mary will buy me one if I let her do Aaron.
JohnnyB
 

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quote:

Maybe Mary will buy me one if I let her do Aaron.
JohnnyB
LOL

yea man, turn 6 is a pain. it's really fun, but it's hard and it's scary. i have a really hard time looking all the way through the corner too, it's hard to turn in and then wrench your head around and look all the way into turn 7. i tacoed a rear rim by running off the outside apex of 6, when the rumble strip ends it ends in a big way. but yea, the forces on a 125 are even stronger than the vintage bikes, the first time i hit the turn in 3rd gear i remember my cheeks getting pulled down...it was quite a rush. you said it's distracting for you? how so? like it's uncomfortable because of the "extra" gravity?

i'm sure you'll get the hang of the brakes if you're used to modern sportbikes. as long as you can stay calm when the back wheel comes up you'll be fine. the back wheel dancing around when i come into turn 3 is mainly the bumps in the track. i try to make sure that i'm braking as hard as possible the whole way, so by picking up the wheel it gives me a reference. but the entrance of 3 is kinda bumpy, so the back tends to jump around a bit when i do that. sometimes i'll try to get extra out of shape if there's someone right behind me, so they spook and back off. but that's thin ice to be skating on. it's mainly for fun, as long as i don't mess up my entry to the corner.

the shifting on the 125s continues to surprise me. i use the clutch on the start and then don't touch it the rest of the session...the bikes are amazing. if you look and listen closely to that on-board video we took, you can tell the difference between good shifts and bad ones. you really only need to blip the throttle about 15% to get a smooth shift. the bad ones are when i blip 30-40% and unload the gears, and the bike sort of balks. there isn't really a redline to speak of, the power flattens off before you have to shift. i usually shift at 12-12,5. some kid i met who rode a 125 with data-acquisition software said he hit 16,600 on a downshift once...no harm done apparently. you asked about engine reliability due to shifting at 12,500 revs? what do you mean?

whoa, this post is long...my bad. sheesh, this is gonna be like homework reading this shit.

Z
 

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By distracting I mean just what you are talking about as far as G-forces. On a vintage bike your going along happy as a clam the whole lap and then all of a sudden in six you have this extra thing to deal with, just kind of blows my concentration. I got better this year, started taking a bit wider line...sorta reduces the "hitting bottom" feeling I get in six.

I ran off the outside once on the exit of six, must have hit five rocks as big as softballs..though for sure I broke a rim or something, just clinched my butt hole and stayed on the gas and before I knew it the track came back and found me.

By reliability... I mean does the engine blow up/wear out sooner shifting at 12.5k as opposed to a lower rpm.

I'm getting all giddy thinking about a 125.... it's...it's....well it's like I'm queer for 125's.
JohnnyB
 

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Discussion Starter #13
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175's for 125's. Soon you'll be back on a 50.
translation: "24hp for 40hp. Soon you'll be back on a 10hp"


no, the engines don't seem to blow up at all. my buddy broke a ring earlier this year, but the bike still finished the race. he also didn't change his crank and probably had almost twice the miles on it he should have, which resulted in a spun big-end bearing. or that's the theory anyway, he still hasn't taken it apart. but to answer your question, no, shifting at 12,500 is just what you have to do. i don't think shortshifting has ever been linked to greater engine life with 125s. you can even get pipes for fast tracks that bring the powerband up to about 11k-13,5k. it's easy to get spoiled by not having to worry about overrev...means you gotta pay attention on vintage bikes.

Z
 
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