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Discussion Starter #883
That thing is buckets of awesome!
 

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Every time that I see one of those I think of this guy:
My Aston Martin's Warranty Has Already Paid For Itself
It is scary how quickly those things can run up bills. My daughter wants a Range Rover for her first car. It was easy to tell her she was crazy when they are $70K, but when LR2s and even some earlier Sports are under $10K it becomes more difficult.
 

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Discussion Starter #892
My main issue with Doug's articles is that he runs right to the dealer at every chance. While that will show the cost of ownership in some ways, it only does so if that is how you plan to own the car.
I bet a 10 year old ANYTHING would be silly money to keep 100% perfect via a dealer.

From what I have read these cars are not as "exotic" as one would think. They can be worked on at home or an indy shop for MUCH less.
 

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He certainly seems to exaggerate for literary purposes, but if it is even a fraction...

It is a little different looking at a Vantage as a weekend fun machine, than an SUV as a daily for a 17 year old girl that will be a few hundred miles away. She isn't doing any repairs on her own. One of the issues I noticed with the luxury marks is that their forum base is not as helpful. They are understandably less DIY and therefore, of less value. I was hoping to find ways to adapt Ford parts and cheap solutions to problems like air suspension. Most of what I found was bitching about dealers and then others bitching that the bitching was about piddling little expenses. ("What's $1,000 here or there?")

I am 100% a Mopar guy, so whatever specific knowledge I have is useless with the higher-dollar/luxury/exotics unless I go back to Jensens, Facel-Vegas, Dual-Ghias or Monteverdis. Speaking of bad ideas of the day... Even if we could find one in our price range (ha!) it is not likely she would go for any of those. ("No MP3 player?") I think I'm just going to get her an older Jeep Patriot.
 

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Patriot is a terrible car. If you have to get a more 'car like' jeep, get a liberty, if you don't trust an xj cherokee that's now 16 years old. Unfortunately, most jeep products pretty much suck after 2001 or so, solid axle - metal bumper models mostly excluded.
The liberty is at least still somewhat robust and not a front wheel drive POS with a crappy automatic transmission.
This advice is from a guy with 20 years of experience with jeeps of all ages, and I'd rather put my kid in a 92-95 xj cherokee than anything else ever built, because they don't fail often, and when they do, it's cheap and easy to fix.
Good luck!
 

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Regardless of whether the Patriot's faux-trail dress-up fetish offends you, there is no justification for buying one. There is no aspect of Patriot ownership that another vehicle does not do better, just as cheaply. It's the Maxim 550 of cars.
 

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I fully agree. I would rather put her in the lifted CJ7 that I inherited from my cousin, but what this kid needs is a FWD POS with a crappy automatic transmission. What she wants is a 4 door Wrangler Rubicon. Actually a G Wagon, but she is willing to settle! We may go for a Liberty if we can find one cheap enough, but she only likes the new square ones. A Nitro (same car, cheaper resale) is apparently no good because, I don't know why. Well, actually she did correctly point out the awkward point where the front end meets the flares. If we were buying a bike, the Maxim 550 is what she would probably be getting.
 

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I've become a pretty good mechanic, to the point of making a living doing it, by having to start out with non-running, shitbox cars, and making them better. I've only ever bought 1 car that already ran. So it's hard for me to be sympathetic to someone who wants to be picky about the car someone else is buying for them.
In the end, if you have to foot the bill for buying it and fixing it, you should seek out one that will be dependable, because a pile of shit with a transmission that will fail before 100k miles will not be easy on your wallet.
I didn't recommend the liberty because it's cute, I recommended it because it will get her through college safely and reliably. The nitro, although ugly is also ok, because it is the same as the liberty. The robustness comes from having a truck based, rear wheel drive transmission, even if it is an automatic, they are much better than any of chrysler's front wheel drive automatics, which historically suck, and are now.getting better thanks to Fiat, although those have a shitload of gears, leading me to think there is no way they'll last past 200k miles.
 

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Tell her to buy her own.
I tried that. She is my stepdaughter and I have only had a limited time to influence her. The reasons why she won't be buying her own would probably violate the no politics and religion rules, or at least devolve into a pissy mess. If she were with me since birth she would have been fixing something off my driveway since she was 12. OTOH, in order to qualify for a car she did raise her average a fairly astounding amount.

I've become a pretty good mechanic, to the point of making a living doing it, by having to start out with non-running, shitbox cars, and making them better. I've only ever bought 1 car that already ran. So it's hard for me to be sympathetic to someone who wants to be picky about the car someone else is buying for them.
In the end, if you have to foot the bill for buying it and fixing it, you should seek out one that will be dependable, because a pile of shit with a transmission that will fail before 100k miles will not be easy on your wallet.
I didn't recommend the liberty because it's cute, I recommended it because it will get her through college safely and reliably. The nitro, although ugly is also ok, because it is the same as the liberty. The robustness comes from having a truck based, rear wheel drive transmission, even if it is an automatic, they are much better than any of chrysler's front wheel drive automatics, which historically suck, and are now.getting better thanks to Fiat, although those have a shitload of gears, leading me to think there is no way they'll last past 200k miles.
Funny you are ripping the Chrysler autos. FWD one have been shit since they added o/d a hundred years ago, but I think they are still considerably better than Honda. I saw that Hondamatic posted the other day and wondered if it were the same trans as in my older girl's Civic. On the bright side Civics have timing chains saving that debacle, though I guess the tensioner will go out and cause the same damage.
 
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