looking for a roller starter

74384 Views 121 Replies 26 Participants Last post by speedrattle, Dec 19, 2020

dirkchecken

Discussion Starter · Mar 1, 2015 (Edited)

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21 - 40 of 122 Posts

Witworth

· #21 · Mar 3, 2015 (Edited)

o1marc said:
When I started my build I was a young 23 year old street racer so this build was suppose to be a street legal full race bike at the time. So in consideration of weight EVERYTHING that didn't have to be on the bike wasn't on the bike. This included elimination of the weight of any electric or kick start parts and would be a bump start only bike. Some of you know the story of this bike how for 35 years I thought this motor was only 1032cc, 10:1cr. After a tear down of the motor after 35 years after never having been fired I realized it was actually 1327cc at 11:1cr and might not be the easiest bike to bump start for a 60 year old guy (not my mind, but the body is showing wear) in 95* Georgia. So I looked into a hand held starter because the spud for the engine was available for a very low price. I even got Alan Sputhe who I bought my heads from to send me a set of pressure relief valves to put in he heads to ease starting. But the mechanic who did the reassembly didn't have the confidence to do them so I'm glad he passed on the job. But now I don't want to tear the top end down again until this freaking thing runs and I put a season on or how ever much time it takes for me to determine it needs to be done. In the mean time I need something to turn the motor over enough to fire it up before a few other things on the bike can be completed.Then I will need something that can be used at the starting line for LSR runs and trackside at RR tracks. and ready for use for DD. I just don't know how hard bump starting will be when I leave my destination without a starter. The hand held was portable enough to have fit in a backpack if need be with the motorcycle battery driving it, but that battery isn't enough torque to turn my motor or I have the wrong starter for this app. So thats why I need something like this.

My old high school buddy built a 1200cc ironhead XL with S&S stroker flywheels, Andrews cams etc. It was a trifle hard to kickstart. So he CCed the heads/pistons etc to work out the compression ratio. It was about 14 : 1. It seems the pistons he got were meant for alky or nitro. He paid $50 for the brand new flywheels and about $100 for the pistons and three crank pins, legit, it was a closing down sale. Went fast. God knows how he started it. But he could. He was a light guy too, so go figure.

Danger, is my business."

44dwarf

· #22 · Mar 3, 2015 (Edited)

I built my own roller starter after seeing a bunch of racers burn tires off on small knurled rollers and a few catch fire... I chose to use 5 inch rimed go cart tires. Yes its higher do to the diameter of the tires but you've got rubber on rubber and 6.5 hp gas motor. most of the parts I had laying around except the motor I was going to use a 5hp 12vdc winch motor but it would have required a jack shaft due to the 6000rpm so a trip to horrible freight and got a gas motor. It will turn my 500 Rotax over with out backing it up.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=430832717023161&l=6689563237930086734

grandpaul

· #23 · Mar 3, 2015

o1marc said:
In the mean time I need something to turn the motor over enough to fire it up before a few other things on the bike can be completed.Then I will need something that can be used at the starting line for LSR runs and trackside at RR tracks...

The good thing is that at MOST racing venues, someone will lend you a hand with starting. I know I spent a good part of my off-bike time helping other folks in the pits, and lent my rollers to anyone who wanted to use them. In fact, I just left them at the outer foot of the EZ-UP, connected and ready to use, right at the edge of pit lane.

jalsteve

· #24 · Mar 3, 2015

Witworth said:
My old high school buddy built a 1200cc ironhead XL with S&S stroker flywheels, Andrews cams etc. It was a trifle hard to kickstart. So he CCed the heads/pistons etc to work out the compression ratio. It was about 14 : 1. It seems the pistons he got were meant for alky or nitro. He paid $50 for the brand new flywheels and about $100 for the pistons and three crank pins, legit, it was a closing down sale. Went fast. God knows how he started it. But he could. He was a light guy too, so go figure.

Danger, is my business."

14:1 on a roller bearing crank, all that movement and so little space!

jalsteve

· #25 · Mar 3, 2015

grandpaul said:
The good thing is that at MOST racing venues, someone will lend you a hand with starting. I know I spent a good part of my off-bike time helping other folks in the pits, and lent my rollers to anyone who wanted to use them. In fact, I just left them at the outer foot of the EZ-UP, connected and ready to use, right at the edge of pit lane.

Good for you, just watch out for the idiots that think that roller starters are rolling roads.

I've seen two EZ starters on fire, one was mine after the foot petal stuck in the on position (try getting a bike off that baby when it spinning 1200rpm and lunching on your nice sticky tyres) and the insulation on those lovely big copper cables melted = short, euphemisms and extinguisher. New switch and new cables and she was good to go. The other was a pit lane fool using a EZ as a rolling road, they had no idea how to use a starter and fried it, the cables caught fire.

Do you roll you bike back onto compression before putting on the starter, especially on singles and big twins?

grandpaul

· #26 · Mar 3, 2015

jalsteve said:
I've seen two EZ starters on fire, one was mine after the foot petal stuck in the on position ...
Do you roll you bike back onto compression before putting on the starter, especially on singles and big twins?

Hee hee I had my pedal stick, too. It looked like the microswitch was installed wrong, so I fixed it. No issues since. I think some people treat it like a mechanical switch, that may contribute to the problem. Sure had toasty connections and burned my thumb getting that ground cable loose. It partially melted the battery terminal!

I do sort the timing of the piston stroke as closely as possible before firing. I haven't had to use it on my 441 yet, but a couple of big thumpers have used it with no worries.

jalsteve

· #27 · Mar 3, 2015

grandpaul said:
Hee hee I had my pedal stick, too. It looked like the microswitch was installed wrong, so I fixed it. No issues since. I think some people treat it like a mechanical switch, that may contribute to the problem. Sure had toasty connections and burned my thumb getting that ground cable loose. It partially melted the battery terminal!

I do sort the timing of the piston stroke as closely as possible before firing. I haven't had to use it on my 441 yet, but a couple of big thumpers have used it with no worries.

Just put it in gear an roll back till bumps up against compression.

Hardest bike to start I have ever had was a husaberg it was use in single cyclinder racing when we could get it going. We could only start it on car powered rollers with two heavy weights draped over the seat.

JackC

· #28 · Mar 3, 2015

Check Craigslist Maine. Not sure if it is still there, but a while ago a fellow I know had one for $250. It was different than the doc Z setup--had a motor with a rubber tired wheel attached to it. You kept your bike on a stand, butted the tire on the starter up to your tire to spin your wheel.

If it is not still there the fellow was Tim Kennedy, Falmouth or Yarmouth Maine. I could maybe find an old email address if you are really interested in it. He used to have "The Motorcycle Shop" in South Freeport Me. Good guy.

Last year the fellow in the pit next to me started a fire with his Doc Z setup. I had never used a fire extinguisher before......

JackC

· #29 · Mar 3, 2015

Got Curious and took a few min to search. I do have an email addy and phone from last year. PM me if you want to contact him.

Mark Burton

· #30 · Mar 3, 2015

Hardest bike to start I have ever had was a husaberg it was use in single cyclinder racing when we could get it going. We could only start it on car powered rollers with two heavy weights draped over the seat.[/QUOTE]

I broke a kick start lever on mine and had to get a pair of marshalls push me while I dropped the clutch in 3rd, keeping the decompressor in until it started to fire. It kicked back and shot the lever up so hard, it snapped the lever once it hit the stop on the casing!

o1marc

· #31 · Mar 3, 2015

I had a Bultaco250 basket case I bought back in the late 70's, put it together and the only way to start it was to tow it behind a car till it was going about 20mph before it would fire off. I lived in the San Fernando Valley outside LA. Had a vacant lot next to my house in the residential neighborhood. I took some old car hoods and made some jumps and set up a little motocross track in that lot and pissed off all the neighbors who had swimming pools that I filled with dirt dust.

grandpaul

· #32 · Mar 3, 2015

o1marc said:
I had a Bultaco250 basket case I bought back in the late 70's, put it together and the only way to start it was to tow it behind a car till it was going about 20mph before it would fire off. I lived in the San Fernando Valley outside LA. Had a vacant lot next to my house in the residential neighborhood. I took some old car hoods and made some jumps and set up a little motocross track in that lot and pissed off all the neighbors who had swimming pools that I filled with dirt dust.

I lost my breath just THINKING about how I had to push-start mine almost every time I rode it; never could get the hang of that left-foot kicker...

...but once it fired off, it was a monster!

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o1marc

· #33 · Mar 14, 2015

I lose my breathe when contemplating push starting 1327cc @11:1cr without pressure relief valves.
I seriously need to make some progress with firing this thing up. Where would I go to advertise in my local area to see if a local racer with a roll starter would loan or rent me one? I don't think it would be wise to start and breaking in this motor from bump starting it.

Camelhairy

· #34 · Mar 14, 2015

Don't even think about the one from OZ. I thought it looked like a good idea but have spent a lot of time making it right. There's nothing on the bottom to dig into the pavement, the rollers touched the bolts on the bearing housings and the rollers slide back and forth. If you ever have to change the sprockets, good luck, they are welded on. It is screwed together with sheet metal screws and the frame is kind of flimsy. It only has 1 motor and the plug for the foot switch is off a computer which won't stay attached. I put in a proper twist lock plug. The only good thing is it will start my 400 CanAm and is easy to roll back onto because the front roller is small. It was over $1200.

o1marc

· #35 · Mar 14, 2015 (Edited)

Camelhairy said:
Don't even think about the one from OZ. I thought it looked like a good idea but have spent a lot of time making it right. There's nothing on the bottom to dig into the pavement, the rollers touched the bolts on the bearing housings and the rollers slide back and forth. If you ever have to change the sprockets, good luck, they are welded on. It is screwed together with sheet metal screws and the frame is kind of flimsy. It only has 1 motor and the plug for the foot switch is off a computer which won't stay attached. I put in a proper twist lock plug. The only good thing is it will start my 400 CanAm and is easy to roll back onto because the front roller is small. It was over $1200.

Which one from Oz were you referring to? I'll make my own before ordering one from across the pond anywhere for what they are getting for them.
I found 2 old 2'x2" rollers with bearings from an old treadmill that I could modify to work in a roll starter.

do you have a pic of yours for me to pick ideas from?

Diamondj

· #36 · Mar 15, 2015 (Edited)

o1marc said:
Which one from Oz were you referring to? I'll make my own before ordering one from across the pond anywhere for what they are getting for them.
I found 2 old 2'x2" rollers with bearings from an old treadmill that I could modify to work in a roll starter.

do you have a pic of yours for me to pick ideas from?

Interesting. We have an old Nordic Track I was going to put out on the curb. I should pull it apart before I do.

Marc - Join the WERA message board and hit up general asking if someone has rollers you could rent or borrow. Post some pictures of your bike. There's more than a few of them in the area and I'll bet at least a few of them would offer to assist.

WERA Motorcycle Roadracing - 13x Forums

Camelhairy

· #37 · Mar 20, 2015

Rosco's Rollers are the ones from OZ

Camelhairy

· #38 · Mar 20, 2015

Here are the pics of the roller starter

Metal Machine Machine tool Cylinder Steel

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grandpaul

· #39 · Mar 20, 2015

Camelhairy said:
Here are the pics of the roller starter
View attachment 13157

Nice. I like that design.

I would be tempted to copy it, but make it a bit narrower, and put a wider base on it. I never liked the extra width of my Solo rig.

Hoofhearted

· #40 · Mar 23, 2015

I got to use a friend's DocZ at Bonneville some years ago. Loved it but didn't have the money for one. I built the sidecar and a roller starter wouldn't work. I got a Dodge pick up starter with built in gear reduction and it drives straight on the crank of the Weslake. 14:1, 36 deg. fixed advance. So far no problems. I made a dolly to carry it around.

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