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Their LiveWire roadshow is in town this weekend. I will not be attending. I will consider the technology to be viable when the range of e-bikes is roughly two-hundred miles of mixed-use riding, full-capacity charging takes less than twenty minutes, and such performance/convenience doesn't cost more than an IC-engined bike. I don't think I'll see it in my lifetime, although great strides have been made. I'd think hydrogen fuel cells will come to the forefront over the next twenty years. By then I'll be in my mid-seventies and likely piloting a Hoveround.
 

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Yay, another electric motorcycle with no practical use.

Range is somewhere around 50 miles.

Hybrid is indeed the future. Currently with a gasoline generator and then switch to one powered by Hydrogen fuel cell.
On-board power generation is practical, electricity stored in batteries is not.
 

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Their LiveWire roadshow is in town this weekend. I will not be attending. I will consider the technology to be viable when the range of e-bikes is roughly two-hundred miles of mixed-use riding, full-capacity charging takes less than twenty minutes, and such performance/convenience doesn't cost more than an IC-engined bike. I don't think I'll see it in my lifetime, although great strides have been made. I'd think hydrogen fuel cells will come to the forefront over the next twenty years. By then I'll be in my mid-seventies and likely piloting a Hoveround.
So basically you see no future for e-bike unless it matched the numbers for IC bike more or less in every sense?
the fact that fuel cost is neglible and that its silent with potentially great power deliver are of no value? (For example)
if I would win in lottery I would order KTM electric freeride with an extra battry right away. I think it would be brilliant and neighbours wouldn't hate me for the noise. Sure it still quite expensive - but not out of this world priced anymore.

Hydrogen? We'll see but that is not simple change, the infrastructure changes would have to massive, I think batteries have great strength in sort of progressive development. They almost work already, and do so for some applications. Hydrogen will need huge investments to get even near where we are now with batteries. Also plugin hybrid cars are actually becoming more common, this will likely provide boost for battery tech (manufacturing cost).
 

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That being said, a 70+ hp e-bikes are hardly sensible with current tech, and for HD to go for e-bikes is utterly weird. Their brand is built on obnoxious noise levels, what do you have left when you take that away? Even shaking would be gone
 

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That being said, a 70+ hp e-bikes are hardly sensible with current tech, and for HD to go for e-bikes is utterly weird. Their brand is built on obnoxious noise levels, what do you have left when you take that away? Even shaking would be gone
I think they have it covered with a really large one of these...
 

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Some of you people have blinders on. The Zero SR is already pumping out very impressive performance with today's batteries. Battery tech gets better as every month passes, just like almost every other aspect of technology. The next new battery which is closest to being ready for mass production charges as quickly as you can fill the tank on your ICE vehicle the cells are supposed to last 20 years. Why is it so hard to look at last year's bikes, compare them to this year's bikes, and not see that they get better every year? Your phone gets better, your tv gets better, your coffee makers and toasters get better. Why wouldn't batteries get better?
 

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Batt bikes are pretty useless. No range. H-D is throwing cash down the john.

H cell vehicles are the future. Batt vehicles are 1900.

In fifty years time you will probably be able to buy a good cheap E commuter scooter.

Danger, is my business.
 

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So basically you see no future for e-bike unless it matched the numbers for IC bike more or less in every sense?
Correct. Why would anyone want to get less performance (range) and wait eight hours to go another fifty miles?

Fuel cells have a greater potential to equal IC vehicles in range and performance - IMO. E-vehicles are showing pretty good numbers in the power department, but until the range and convenience issues get solved, they will be an interesting sidebar for me.

True, fuel cells lack an infrastructure, but with all the electric vehicle hoopla that has been around for over a decade now, vehicle charging stations are still few and far between - and electricity is readily available.

Either way it falls, I won't be around to enjoy it.
 

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This whole deal is just goofy. I am tired of people I know asking me what I think & if I will get one when they come out. I couldn't care less about that turd.
 

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The funny thing is fuel cells and the fuel storage tanks are basically overly complex battery systems. You are just turning the electricity into hydrogen in a fuel production facility and "recharging" by pumping that fuel into your tank so it can be turned back into electricity by your fuel cell. Batteries just skip the part where you have to convert the electricity to hydrogen and back again.

No one has bothered addressing the tech curve of batteries because they are too busy living in a fantasy world where there are no functional electric vehicles for another few decades or more. It's as if batteries stopped being developed last year and we are just stuck with what is currently being mass produced. Get your heads out of the sand already!
 

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The problem with the hype around Batt vehicles is " It's just around the corner ". It's been around the corner for thirty years.

I could go and buy a Jap electric car tomorrow. I've thought about it for six months. But the dealers can't stand the useless things, warranty and backup is a bit sketchy and when the Batt pack dies the car is worth about a third of what I'd pay for it.

Until batteries are virtually free, the economics of Batt vehicles basically suck.

I've known guys in the eco car and E tech industry for decades. They have had all the best ideas, patents and cash from bored millionaires. It all goes flat, and to nowhere.

Go live in a city with trains, walk, and ride a bicycle. Commuting is a obsolete curse on humanity. If you live twenty miles from a city centre, well more fool you.

Danger, is my business.
 

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Looks like the old racist has finally lost his damn mind.
 
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Looks like the old racist has finally lost his damn mind.
I hear a soft voice, from well beyond the ramparts and gates of civilisation. Is there anybody out there?, just nod if you can hear me.

If you can't get a Latte in ten minutes walking distance, you are an auslander. And ein Steppenwolf.

Danger, is my business.
 

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Harley's main stream clients are a dying of old age (and Witworth's rantings:rolleyes:)
Youngsters have no interest in these old farts bikes. This is the reason for their new 500/750 range.
What great marketing from the MoCo methinks, a PS3/XBox/Wii on two wheels.
Batteries are definitely here to stay. The USA's presence in Afganistan looking after the worlds biggest deposits of Lithium will ensure it.
Personally I would'nt buy one. I prefer the noisy rattlely things I ride now.
Hey if the trailer park guys can't fix em, they won't sell.
 

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100-150 mile range would be plenty to create a very viable market. Maybe not for YOU but in the world. Just visited Barcelona and I can tell you - the city is full of bikes that get a lot of miles per year (way more than typical US bikes) - yet I doubt they commonly see more than 30-40 miles per day.

Battery tech has taken huge steps - phones, cordless tools, cameras are drastically better than just 10 yrs ago. You have to be in idiot to claim that the tech is all the just around the corner - it will probably never be 100% alternative to gas/diesel but there already is a working market for many vehicles and its growing all the time. With better tech more and more applications start making sense - yeah not quite there for a leisure bike and cost is still high - but all the time getting better.

And batteries have to be free? Just like gas has to be free for IC to make sense?
 

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I stopped by the HD stealership I used to work at and talked to some of the mechanics and salesmen. Only one seemed to think the electric hog might be viable - the rest (me included) think it's a gimmick. When I went to work in the service department, the first thing they did was have me watch videos about the history of their bikes and why people are so intent on owning one. It's not performance - it's the feeling of "freedom" and "an American classic" and a connection to riders of the past. It made want to laugh/puke at the same time. Whatever the reason, a lot of men and women want something heavy, loud, vibrates and is an obvious status symbol. We have a country that seems to worship uber-bimbos like Pamela Anderson, so is it a surprise we want an overblown and overhyped relic?

The first thing most buyers do is have a new exhaust fitted because they want others to hear them coming. It's not the "loud pipes save lives" tripe - merely a look-at-me thought process. The only way an electric bike will provide that is with speakers belching the obnoxious rumble. Of course, what will happen to the nylock industry when their biggest customer no longer needs hardware designed to resist heavy vibration?
 
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