ULWSV vs LWSV

and another thing.
in returning to the original thread...there is an awful lot of logic and common sense to the argument for returning the mt125r back into the ulwsv class. not having any vested interest in the outcome of the issue (wish i did...), and being one who has been around a while, i think it's a no brainer. the fact that one or two guys can go very quickly on their mt.s is a dumb reason to have them removed from the class. in my primary class, 250gp, as a competative person, i wish phil t. wasn't in front of me while we are racing but i am thrilled to have a chance (well maybe half a chance) (maybe a half assed chance?) to try to beat him. the fact is that he prepares his bike well, rides well, and gets it done to see the checkered flag before me most of the time. and he would do the same thing again with his mt. in ulwsv. that's racing at its best. and as much as i LOVE to needle johnny bravo, the fact is that although his yam TA is a notch down performance wise to the mt.s, riding his TA, he can ride around all but the best guys on their mt.s. when the mt.s are allowed back in, there will be bigger grids, a good thing. the class will be richer, more fun, and the spectating (remember the spectators count too) will be better it's really simple. mid 70s 125 are ulwsv bikes...all of them. just my opinion.
parks
p.s: and johnny bravo will have a real fight on his hands trying to defend his championship too.

My two cents.

If no other reason than AHRMA is the only true national organization - and I already know that USCRA is not AHRMA - MTs and TAs run in their Formula 125 class. 250cc bikes, e.g. TD2 Yamahas run in the Formula 250 class. 200cc GP bike bump up class is the Formula 125 class and 250cc bike bump up class is the Formula 250 class. To me it makes no sense to force MT125s and TA125s to run with Yamaha TD2s - as their primary class. They're giving up half the displacement and more than half the horspower. I don't see how you can make rules that allow bikes to bump up with the intention of being competitive. 200cc GP bikes should not be competitive with MT125s in the MT125s primary class. Just as 200cc GP bikes should not be competitive in the 250GP class. Nor should 250GP bikes be competitive in their bump up class. They should be competitive in their primary class. The USCRA seems to be trying to make bump up classes competitive. MTs and TAs should go back to ULSV as the primary class. Any 200cc bike that wins in that class deserves it. And any 250GP bike should bump up to LWSV, and the fast rider on his 250 bike could win there as well. Which Roper and Turk have done on their 250cc GP bikes.

I think the USCRA classes can be a bit skewed by the fact that we don't have the number of races or size of grids that will shake out a "True" average.

For instance...in my case, typically in ULWSV I can finish 3-4 ahead of all but the fastest guys in the class with my 200gp bike. And Zack showed that a 200gp bike slower than mine can go a second faster than I do. Which....doesn't really mean 200gp bikes are the equivilant of ULWSV bikes...it just means that the balance of the ULWSV class isn't up to speed yet like Turk, Marty or Champ are.

When you put an ULWSV bikes in LWSV it doesn't mean they are necessarily fast enough to run there on average...it means that Turk, Mary and Champ are fast enough to run there.

See what I mean? It takes six or seven races for the "trends" to show up. Yeah Roper can almost win 350 gp at will on a 250gp bike...but will that be the case when running AHRMA size grids and number of races?

When I look at the way 200gp is setup it seems just about perfect. I always have a shot at winning a 200gp race. I have an chance of winning a 250gp race if the fast guys don't show up, same with ULWSV....I'll beat some of them in both cases...but if the top half of the class shows up I don't have a chance. A 200gp bike shouldn't be truly competitive in a full grid of either 250gp or ULWSV. But...since often the grid will be missing the prime time players..I might have a shot.

I don't think there should ever be a bump class where the fastest rider in the lower class can win any time he wants in the bump class no matter who shows up.

But then there are the exceptions like Roper and Turk...can you really make any intelligent decisions on speed indexes when looking at guys that are leaps and bounds ahead of the competition in both machinery and skill? You just have to live with those guys...they set the example for the rest of us and it's also unfair to skew the classes just to keep that kind of rider from winning.

From what I've seen of most ULWSV riders they are appreciative of the true racing pedigree of their bikes and don't mind mixing it up with bikes considerably (or potentially) faster than theirs.
JohnnyB